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Pregnant in Law School | Part 5: Adjusting to law school life as the mother of a newborn

Fri, 2015-05-15 10:28

Third-year law student Joni Bodnar balanced caring for a newborn with finishing her final semester at KU Law.

The first week after having baby Kendall was a blur of visitors, along with trying to recover from surgery. I was healing well enough that I could stop taking pain killers just six days after my C-section, which allowed me time to be free of any grogginess when I returned to school the following Monday.

The school never told me how much time I was allowed to take off to recover, though I am sure they would have given me all the time I needed had I asked. I personally made the decision to only take off one week because I did not want to make it too difficult to get caught up when I finally did return. Fortunately, everything went well post-op, and the only compromise my doctor forced upon me was to have someone else drive me to school my first day back.

Aside from worrying about being physically ready to return to school, I was concerned about how to continue my choice to breast feed when I would be away from Kendall for almost nine hours every Monday, and then six hours every Tuesday and Wednesday. When I contacted KU Law about potential accommodations, they were more than willing to help me find a safe, private place to pump while I was away, and even offered to store my milk supply for me.

Once I had a plan in place for my return and how to handle pumping, my only concerns were how to stay awake during class and how to survive being away from my beautiful baby girl so soon. Surprisingly, I never had an issue staying awake in class, regardless of how little sleep I had the night before (though my mandatory morning coffee probably helped).

As for being away from Kendall, I think any new mom will tell you that as hard as it may be, one way to survive the day is to stay busy with plenty of distractions. With law school, I always had plenty to do, so I kept myself busy with schoolwork (and pumping) between classes. I was also lucky enough to have a retired father and close-to-retired mother and mother-in-law taking care of Kendall while I was at school. This allowed me to regularly check in on her, and also meant I regularly received picture messages showcasing her day at home without me.

On a couple occasions when I did not have a day care option, I was lucky enough that both Dean Mazza and Professor Yung allowed me to bring Kendall to class! I was not sure how things would go considering both times I brought her (Tax Procedure one day and Criminal Procedure the other), class was two hours long.  She managed to make it through with very few issues, although she made sure Professor Yung knew when it was time for a break halfway through by announcing with a tiny shriek!

Overall, I can’t say that returning to school so soon was easy, but I think that in general, moms have this inexplicable ability to make things work, no matter what. It takes a lot of prioritization and planning, but I did not feel overwhelmed. I was able to care for my newborn, continue my final semester of law school, take care of my two older children and their daily extracurricular activities, keep up with household chores (most of the time), and even work out most days.

Without the help of the fantastic people in my life, both at school and at home, much of this would not be possible. I am truly blessed for all the help and support from not only my immediate family, but also from my law school family. Having gone through this experience over the past year, I have come to realize how truly great my decision was to attend law school at KU. The faculty, students and staff have far exceeded my expectations of what it means to be a community.

— Joni Bodnar is a third-year law student from St. Joseph, Missouri. This is her final post in a five-part series about being pregnant during law school. Previous posts recounted her reaction to finding out she was expecting a baby during law school, how she got through her summer internship during her first trimester of pregnancy, staying focused through classes and finals while pregnant, and meeting her new daughter, Kendall.

Graduate Profiles: Jason Harmon, L'15, & Paul Mose, L'15

Thu, 2015-05-14 10:00
Jason HarmonJason Harmon and Paul Mose followed similar paths through law school — both have young families, were moot court partners and will work at Kansas City firm Shook Hardy & Bacon after graduation.
For Harmon and Mose, balancing the roles of husband, father and student proved the most challenging aspect of law school.   “My wife and kids deserve a law degree of their own,” said Harmon, father of a 4-year-old, 3-year-old and 1-year-old. “They’ve made many sacrifices and are looking forward to being done. We’ve grown a lot as a family and made a lot of friends at KU Law.”
One of those friends was Mose, a husband and father of a 1-year-old from Emporia, Kansas, who says he learned about balancing multiple priorities from Harmon. “I saw how he successfully balanced having a wife, three kids, living in the country, school and church responsibilities,” Mose said. “I imagine most in my class would agree that we’ve learned far more from our classmates than any particular class.”
Paul Mose“There came a point in my second year where I was not sure if I could physically do everything,” Harmon said. “Just when I’d have that thought, I’d get another Law Review assignment.” He persevered by keeping his priorities in check, going home for dinner every night and spending time with his family on the weekends.
“My kids are small, and they’ll never be small again,” Harmon said. “I made a firm commitment at the beginning of law school never to forget that.”
For Mose, the adjustment to law school took a lot of prayer and learning from mistakes, but the big moments — like winning KU’s in-house moot court competition with Harmon – made it worth it.With the support of their families, both Harmon and Mose not only survived law school, but thrived, and found a place in the KU Law community in the process.
“When we came to Lawrence, it was the farthest east we had ever been,” said Harmon, an Orem, Utah, native. “Now we plan on staying.”

Graduate Profile: Caroline Gurney, L'15 & Tyler Manson, L'15

Wed, 2015-05-13 14:00
Caroline Gurney and Tyler Manson met on the first day of law school orientation and began dating the following semester.
“Our ‘first date’ was when my car ran out of gas as I was driving home from class one day,” Manson said. “I decided to call Caroline, partially because I knew she had just gotten out of class, but I would be lying if I said it wasn’t because I had a crush on her. After that and a few more dates, we were inseparable.”

The couple’s blossoming relationship was of special note, as Gurney’s parents also met as KU Law students. They went on to marry, have four kids, and forge two successful legal careers between them.

“I think I remind Caroline’s dad of himself when he was young,” Manson said. “His car was falling apart, he was always late to class, and he was dating a girl who was way out of his league.”

Gurney and Manson relied on each other and their classmates to handle the stress and long hours of law school. Both balanced their studies with part-time legal work, and Manson served on the Kansas Journal of Law & Public Policy for two years. They got through by keeping a consistent schedule, making down time with friends a priority and staying focused on the end goal.

As for the future? Gurney will join Orrick and Erskine LLP, an Overland Park firm specializing in eminent domain and condemnation, while Manson will work for Warner Robinson LLC in Kansas City, Missouri, a firm that focuses on corporate tax credits.

“My mom and dad have set a wonderful example of how two people can do good work in the Kansas City legal community and be outstanding parents at the same time,” Gurney said. “I look to them for guidance on work-life balance.”

“As long as we can continue to respect and support each other’s career and personal goals, we’ll be OK,” Manson said. “We make a great team.”

Graduate Profile: Jake McMillian, L'15

Tue, 2015-05-12 16:03
Before law school, Jake McMillian contends that his grasp of the law ran about as deep as an episode of “Law and Order: SVU.” But after three years in Green Hall, he’s armed with the knowledge and experience to launch his legal career and advocate effectively for his passion, LGBTQ rights.
“Kansas is a tough place for LGBTQ rights,” he said. “That being said, law is as effective a tool for creating change as any, and if I truly want to do this work, then Kansas — my home — is a great place to do it.”
McMillian notes his role in planning the 2015 Diversity in Law Banquet as his most enriching law school experience. Hosted this year by the student group OUTLaws & Allies, the annual event is a major fundraiser for the school’s diversity scholarship fund. “It was the first time that the LGBTQ student group hosted the event, and we raised more money than any banquet in history,” McMillian said. “It was a big moment for KU and for OUTLaws.”
Classmates and faculty rely on McMillian for his tireless support of the school and his peers, but he sees his allegiance as the natural response to the support he received from KU.
“KU Law administration, faculty and students have invested a lot in me as a student and as a professional,” he said. “KU has demonstrated that they see value in me and my interests by recruiting me, hiring me in Admissions to recruit diverse students, sending me to LGBTQ legal conferences to focus my craft, and seeking my guidance and recommending me for committees regarding student safety and inclusion.”
“I support KU Law because KU Law has done so much to support me. Being valued by your institution is the most any student can ever ask for.”

Graduate Profile: Nick Puckett, L'15

Tue, 2015-05-12 09:48
While many law school graduates dream of launching their careers with big firms or large companies, Nick Puckett always knew he wanted to practice in a rural area.
“I enjoy the outdoors, and a smaller community represents more opportunities to pursue outdoor activities with my kids,” Puckett said. “I also wanted to be in a place where I could contribute. I feel like a smaller community gives me the chance to plug in and really make a difference.”
Puckett served in the U.S. Army before law school, continuing his commitment with the National Guard throughout his studies. “After 70-plus hours a week in the military, the amount of time needed for law school didn't seem all that intimidating,” Puckett said. “It helped me take a disciplined approach to studying. I'm now a commander in the National Guard, and a lot of what I do is resolving soldier issues and unexpected roadblocks in training. Law school has helped me approach problems more analytically and broadened my leadership skills.”
Balancing school, family and military commitments was not easy, but Puckett credits his wife and two children with providing constant support, and his professors for their guidance and mentorship.
“As an undergrad, I focused on getting done and getting out,” Puckett said. “In law school, I had a lot of great professors willing to take time [with me] outside of the classroom. Also, I have to acknowledge Career Services and LaVerta’s candy bowl.”
Puckett is looking forward to establishing roots with his family in Salina, Kansas, and growing his career with Salina firm Brown & Vogel. 
“My success will depend on my continued willingness to learn and hard work,” he said. “I can’t wait.”


Graduate Profile: Tamara Combs, L'15

Mon, 2015-05-11 11:52
Tamara Combs arrived in Lawrence after studying law in her home country of Brazil, then earning degrees in political science and city and regional planning in the U.S. For her, law school wasn’t just an academic experience; it was a cross-cultural one.
“It was fascinating to navigate a new legal tradition — common law instead of civil law — and see that one is not intrinsically better than the other,” Combs said. “The educational systems are strikingly different. Experiencing both made me a more pragmatic problem-solver, knowing that there is more than one right way to achieve a goal.”
While students of all backgrounds grapple with unfamiliar legal concepts, Combs faced the added challenge of studying the law in her second language. “I overcame that the only way I knew: through hard work and discipline,” she said. “If a reading was especially dense, I just had to put in more hours than my peers, and use the dictionary more often.”
Combs focused her studies on immigration law and international law, and counts her time on the editorial board of the Kansas Law Review among her most enriching law school experiences. This fall she will join the Kansas City office of Stinson Leonard Street as a litigation associate, handling a caseload ranging from local municipal planning issues to international business and immigration matters.
“I will use my planning background and my international background to build a rewarding practice,” she said.

Pregnant in Law School | Part 4: Meeting Baby Kendall

Thu, 2015-05-07 14:28

In order to survive my last semester as a law student with a brand new baby, I did a lot of planning ahead of time. KU Law offers two winter intercession courses that count for the spring semester, as well as an additional intercession course immediately following spring semester finals. These courses would account for 6 of my remaining 11 credit hours, leaving only 5 hours for me to take during the actual semester.

Things do not always go as planned when it comes to babies, though, and I barely made it through the first 2-hour intercession course after having two early labor scares. I was not due until the second week of the spring semester, but I did not want to risk being unable to finish the second winter intercession course. The school allowed me to drop without a penalty due to the circumstances, so I was able to relax at home those last couple of weeks before my due date.

I had to schedule a C-section since I had two prior C-sections with my other children, thus I was lucky enough to be able to pick any date from a week prior to the baby’s due date. My original plan was to schedule surgery the day before my due date, so that I could miss as little school as possible, but with the labor scares, my doctor decided it was best to schedule it a week before the due date.

On Friday, Jan. 23, 2015, I gave birth to my amazing little girl, Kendall Marie! She was 6 pounds, 2 ounces, and 19.5 inches long. She was also born with a full head of dark hair, which was a huge shock to me and my husband. Everything went extremely well, and I was able to leave the hospital after only two nights (at my request – if I’m recovering, I would rather do it in my own home and save the money!).

That first week home with my new baby girl was such a blur! Aside from being on pain meds while recovering from my surgery, my husband and I found ourselves deep in the life of no sleep as new parents. Kendall was completely mixed up on her nights and days, so she was sleeping during the day and awake at night. They say to sleep when your baby sleeps, but that is not realistic when you also have two other children to take care of (and one comes down with the flu that first week home with the new baby).

I was so grateful for the time I got with my new baby girl, and I enjoyed every moment before I had to return to school the following week. Even though I was only getting about two hours of sleep at a time, there is something about being a new parent that keeps your adrenaline going and allows you to not even care about your sleep schedule. During many of those late-nights feedings, I would just stare into my new baby’s beautiful eyes and think how amazing she is. And as I thought about returning to school so soon after having her, I reminded myself that I was finishing school for her as well. I wasn’t finishing just to better provide for her, though, but also as an example of how women can pursue both a career and a family without sacrificing either one.

&#8212 Joni Bodnar is a third-year law student from St. Joseph, Missouri. This is her fourth post in a five-part series about being pregnant during law school. In the final installment, Bodnar will talk about adjusting to law student life as the mother of a newborn. Previous posts recounted her reaction to finding out she was expecting a baby during law school, how she got through her summer internship during her first trimester of pregnancy, and staying focused through classes and finals while pregnant.

Pregnant in Law School | Part 3: Staying focused

Tue, 2015-04-28 13:26

From left: Law students Jennifer Hackman, Professor Bill Westerbeke, Joni Bodnar, Ashlyn Lindskog, Andrea Horvath and Suzanne Hale at a baby shower that Westerbeke threw for Bodnar.

By the time the fall semester began, I was almost halfway through my pregnancy at 18 weeks. I had made it through my summer internship and, most importantly, the first trimester!

I was feeling so good at that point in my pregnancy that I was able to get up early every morning and work out before I had to get the two oldest kids up and ready for school. Now, if I could recommend anything to any pregnant woman, let alone a pregnant law student, it would be to try your best to work out regularly, if possible. I did not exercise much during my first two pregnancies, but it made a tremendous difference during the third one. I felt physically better all around as a result, and it allowed me to have an hour each day to forget about school and the billion things I constantly had to manage.

That fall semester was a busy one for me. I took an additional 3-hour course when I found out I was pregnant (so I could take fewer hours when the baby arrived), giving me a total of 15 hours. This may not sound so bad, but add in the fact that I commute an hour each way every day and have two older kids in a ton of sports and activities, and things can get a little crazy. But this was the case even before I was pregnant, so my pregnancy did not really impact my schedule too much.

The biggest obstacle that semester was my lack of ability to focus for extended periods of time, which is a fairly common issue during pregnancy. I read a ton of articles online claiming that pregnant women can’t perform as well on tests because of this, so I was honestly a little worried about taking finals in December when I was 8.5 months along.

Though I did get distracted easier while studying throughout the semester, I now know not to believe a word of those online resources regarding any correlation to test performance. I am here to officially say that, after taking my finals — including an intellectual property exam that ran from 9 a.m. to 5 p.m. — there is no truth to that!

Looking back on my fall semester being pregnant, it was honestly one of the most enjoyable times I had while attending law school. Maybe it was partially due to finally reaching 3L status, or maybe due to the excitement and anticipation of my new baby. Honestly, though, I believe all the wonderful friends and professors are what truly made that semester so amazing. I received so much support and understanding on all fronts. One of my professors even threw me a small, intimate baby shower with the help of one of my closest law school friends. I don’t know how many people can say their professor gave them a baby shower, and for that I am truly blessed in knowing that I picked the absolute best law school to spend three years of my life!

— Joni Bodnar is a third-year law student from St. Joseph, Missouri. This is her third post in a five-part series about being pregnant during law school. In future installments, Bodnar will address planning for and delivering her daughter, and returning to school after her baby's arrival. Her first post recounted her reaction to finding out she was expecting a baby during law school, and her second post detailed how she got through her summer internship during her first trimester of pregnancy.

Pregnant in Law School | Part 2: The Internship

Tue, 2015-04-14 12:57

From left, Grant Treaster, Paul Budd, Joni Bodnar and Christopher Staley (Washburn).

By Joni Bodnar

Like many 2Ls beginning their summer internship, I was extremely nervous and worried about making a good impression, hoping for that coveted offer of full-time employment at the end of the summer. I was also one of five interns, and we all knew we most likely were competing for a limited number of offers. So, no pressure whatsoever!

I was only two weeks into that “no-pressure” internship when I found out I was pregnant. This was one of the most nerve-wracking things of all to sort through. In a normal job situation, I would simply wait the requisite 12 weeks and then make the joyous announcement to my boss and fellow co-workers that I was expecting. No big deal, right?

Well, a summer legal internship was completely different. I had only three months to show what I was made of, to show that I was a dedicated, driven employee to whom they would definitely want to make an offer of permanent employment.

My baby news created two complications for me. The first one was how to deal with breaking the news. Should I tell them I was pregnant right away so they would not think I was rude when I turned down offers of camaraderie over beers? Or should I try to hide it, and basically fib my way through those first 12 weeks, with false excuses as to why I was not fully participating? This was a real dilemma because the social aspect of the summer internship is a pretty big deal, and I did not want to seem like I was not a team player and lose an offer because I did not fit in socially with the firm.

The second issue: If I planned to hide the pregnancy until I was further along, how would I account for my perpetual exhaustion and the multiple bathroom trips as I dealt with my nausea?

I decided to put my research skills to good use and found out I was allowed to drink 200 mg of caffeine per day. I also looked up every coffee on the Starbucks menu and found out I could still have most grande lattes and be under the 200 mg mark (though it was a far cry from the quad-shot lattes to which I was accustomed).

My internal struggle with when and how to break the news was eventually solved for me when a partner jokingly gave me a hard time for not having a beer at a social function. I was 10 weeks along and had just had a sonogram of my baby a few days earlier confirming her health, so I figured now was as good a time as any to share my news.

The partners’ reactions to my news was better than I could have ever hoped, and I was immediately met with congratulatory hugs and cheers. All my fears about sharing my news were much more trivial than I had built them up in my head. No one even noticed my exhaustion or multiple bathroom trips. I felt so relieved, and I realized that even though this was a summer internship, I was still surrounded by normal people who were extremely excited to share in the joy of my baby news.

&#8212 Joni Bodnar is a third-year law student from St. Joseph, Missouri. This is her second post in a five-part series about being pregnant during law school. In future installments, Bodnar will address tackling her fall semester, planning for and delivering her daughter, and returning to school after her baby's arrival. Her first post recounted her reaction to finding out she was expecting a baby during law school.

Pregnant in Law School | Part 1: The Big News

Mon, 2015-04-06 12:30

By Joni Bodnar

When I first learned I was pregnant, I had just completed my 2L year and was two weeks into my summer internship with a law firm. Now I know there are many different emotions a woman may feel when she finds out she is pregnant, depending on her particular circumstances. Since I was already married with two children, ages 5 and 7, one would think the news of a third child on the way would cause me elation, but that honestly was not my initial reaction.


John and Joni Bodnar with children Addison Beffa, 8 (left), and Harper Beffa, 5

Don’t get me wrong, my husband and I had actually talked many times about having a third child, since both of my older children were from a previous marriage and this would be our first child together. We talked about possibly having a baby during my third and final year of law school as opposed to my first year as a lawyer. We even talked about how perfect it would be if I got pregnant in April of my 2L year, because then the baby would be due over Christmas break. (And as we all know, babies always come at the most convenient time!)

When April came and went, my husband and I decided we should probably just wait on the whole baby thing. At that point, any baby would be arriving during my last semester of law school, which is when I am supposed to be interviewing for jobs, applying to take the bar exam, etc.

Exactly 29 days after our decision to hold off on expanding our family, we found out we were expecting our third child! My first reaction was to immediately process the news from a pragmatic standpoint: How would I handle being pregnant during my current summer internship? How would I handle missing school my final semester? How would I handle day care? These were things I needed to have completely figured out right away so that I could feel secure and happy with the ultimately great news of having another baby.

But as the initial shock wore off, I slowed down and realized I had plenty of time to figure out all the little details. Then, I did something very foreign to me: I began focusing on one day at a time, one thing at a time.

I first decided to focus on figuring out my schedule for my 3L year, so I contacted the dean to get permission to decrease my course load for the spring below the required 12 hours. I also added 3 hours to my fall schedule. Then I put my name on a list and turned in a deposit for day care. With those initial concerns out of the way, I could turn my attention to the next task: getting through the first trimester of pregnancy as a legal intern, sans caffeine!

&#8212 Joni Bodnar is a third-year law student from St. Joseph, Missouri. This is her first post in a five-part series about being pregnant during law school. In future installments, Bodnar will address getting through her summer legal internship during her first trimester, tackling her fall semester, planning for and delivering her daughter, and returning to school after her baby's arrival.

Law school no exception to 'practice makes perfect' mantra

Mon, 2015-03-23 15:34

Over the last three years, I’ve noticed striking similarities between playing sports and being a law student. Both activities require lots of time and dedication. To excel in either, you must learn the game, discover your strengths and weaknesses, and of course practice, practice, practice in preparation for game day. To be successful in law school, there are three things to remember: train daily, practice makes perfect, and play until the end.

Train Daily

Like being introduced to a new sport, very few people come to law school knowing already how to play the game. During the first year, I spent most of my time learning the fundamental concepts and doctrines of the law. The thought of having only one exam at the end of the semester to determine my grade was worrisome. What I learned is that I have to train daily to be successful.

High-performing athletes maintain a daily training regimen: early morning workouts, strict diets and meal plans, and reviewing game film. Similarly, successful law students train daily. My daily training consists of reading for class, reviewing class notes, or preparing an outline/study guide. Something can be done everyday to prepare for finals. Spreading work over a span of 15 weeks is much easier than cramming at the end of the semester. A classmate of mine goes on a series of short runs, ranging from 6 to 10 miles, in the months leading up to running a marathon. The same concept must be applied to law school exams. Mastering your coursework a day at a time paves the road to law school success.

Practice Makes Perfect

Practice? Yes. In the famous words of Allen Iverson, “We talkin’ about practice.” Practice is an essential piece of playing a sport. In practice, you learn plays, prepare for specific scenarios, and build endurance. Some high-performing athletes even visualize their performance before each game. I have learned that by practicing, I am much more prepared to answer final exam questions.

After I have spent some time training, I like to see how well I’ve mastered the material by answering practice questions. One invaluable resource available to law students is access to old exams and test questions. If time permits, I take as many practice tests as possible to get familiar with analyzing facts and applying the law clearly and concisely. Similar to professional athletes preparing for certain situations, the more familiar you are with various fact patterns, the more prepared you will be on test day. An NFL football team would not show up to the Super Bowl without practicing first; a successful law student should not show up to the final exam without answering practice questions.

Play Until the End

Playing “until the whistle blows” is a familiar sports mantra. I have learned to apply that same attitude toward law school. A shining example of playing until the end of the game is KU’s late season basketball game against West Virginia. The Jayhawks rallied from down 18 to beat the Mountaineers in overtime. The ’Hawks erased a 4-point deficit in the last 49 seconds of the fourth quarter. If the team had decided that this game was over and gave up, they would not have tied the game, sending it to overtime and ultimately claiming victory.

In the last few years, there have been times that I didn’t fully comprehend a concept or doctrine until the final week, even days, before the semester’s end. Sometimes it is hard to see the big picture until you’ve learned all of the parts that make the whole. Sticking with a subject until it clicks is necessary for success.

Similarly, I have had the same attitude in final exams. Last semester I found myself extremely flustered during my Federal Income Tax final. I came to a question that completely derailed me, and I contemplated what would happen if I quit, left the exam unfinished and walked out. After a split second, I came back to reality and said to myself, “Just finish the exam.” Good thing I did, because I did much better than expected. Deciding to give up is never a good plan. It is unwise to let one question get under your skin. There are many points to gain on a final exam. Staying the course, finishing the exam and answering as much as possible before time runs out is the best way to maximize your test score. Athletes and law students alike should commit to playing until the end.

To conclude, successful law students should approach the semester the same as athletes approach a big game or match. Taking time to train daily, practicing to gain familiarity, and playing until the end are all methods that have worked for me in my journey through law school. Hopefully one or more of these tips will assist you with navigating through your education experience as well.

Johnathan Koonce is a third-year law student and KU Law Student Ambassador from Colorado Springs, Colorado.

3L gains experience, confidence through Tribal Judicial Support Clinic

Tue, 2015-03-10 10:32
Third-year law student Zach Boggan developed an interest in Indian law when he took a course on the subject and participated in the Native American Law Students Association moot court program. “It can be hard to find a firm practicing Indian law in a meaningful way,” Boggan said. “That’s what drove me to the clinic, to get a practical application of Indian law.”
As a Tribal Judicial Support Clinic participant, Boggan helped tribes develop new legislation and review existing legal code, double-checking everything from grammar errors to federal statute references.
Boggan’s work to develop a guardianship code for a tribe relocating to Kansas proved to be his most rewarding clinic experience. “Guardianship is very important to Indian tribes because the federal government has gone so far as to forcibly remove Indian children from their families and place them with white families to assimilate them to white culture,” Boggan said. “A guardianship code allows tribes to keep their children in a way that not only serves the child’s interests, but also serves the tribe’s interests in terms of allowing them to keep their culture, to keep their tribe together.”
Boggan researched guardianship codes of other states and tribes, then created a new one that accommodated his client’s circumstances yet still followed the letter of the law. “Making sure it was a functioning code was the hardest part,” Boggan said. “There were good parts of other codes that I wanted to stitch in there, but everything had to be added in a way that it would be functional by the time it got to the tribe.”
Clinic participants collaborate with tribal attorneys who know their subject area well but lack resources and support. “Tribes have really thin, stretched legal resources. They might have a sizeable tribe or reservation, but have one tribal attorney or no tribal attorney. Anything we can do helps them out tremendously,” Boggan said. “They don’t need to be told what to do, they just need help doing it, and that’s where we come in.”
While the hands-on legal research and writing was beneficial, Boggan found the practical aspects of team collaboration, interoffice communication and client interaction to be among the most valuable lessons of his clinic experience. Tribal Judicial Support Clinic students and Professor Elizabeth Kronk Warner, the clinic director, met once a week to discuss projects, interview clients and assign tasks.
“Most of the time Professor Kronk Warner put the client on speaker phone and had us ask questions so we could get used to soliciting the information we needed, get used to interacting with clients and get that confidence to act like an attorney,” Boggan said. “We’d meet and talk about what we were going to do, what our responsibilities would be, then start diving in.”
Boggan plans to move back home to Tennessee to launch his legal career. He’s confident that his clinic experience has prepared him for life beyond law school, both because of his exposure to a specialized area of the law and because of the hands-on experience he gained.
“Whenever you mention Indian law, it’s pretty impressive to a lot of practitioners because it’s so unknown. Everyone knows about contracts, torts, business associations, but hardly anyone knows about Indian law. If an attorney has any connection to it, it stands out,” Boggan said.
“Law school gets so abstract. It’s important to learn how to practice, and clinics start you on that path. If you take a class in contracts or workers' comp, you aren’t going to be ready to try a case or go in front of a mediator, but when you do a clinic and interact with real people and see how it happens in the real world, you’ll be more confident.”

- Zach Boggan is a third-year law student from Kingsport, Tennessee.

I get by with a little help from my friends

Thu, 2015-03-05 12:08

From left: Law students Jennifer Hackman, Professor Bill Westerbeke, Joni Bodnar, Ashlyn Lindskog, Andrea Horvath and Suzanne Hale.


I began a little routine during my last semester of my 3L year at KU Law. It starts with dragging myself out of bed and giving myself a pep talk as I blankly stare into my closet for 10 minutes.

“OK, Ashlyn. You can do this. You can be a person today. You’re almost done. Who cares what anyone says … leggings are absolutely pants.”

The necessity of this routine probably stems from a number of different places. First, I really hate putting on pants. Second, the law school grind seems so familiar and “old hat” that it requires an extra dose of motivation at this point. “3L-itis” is a very real thing, and coming out the other side of a three-year long panic attack offers some perspective. It will all get done because it always does. Having a clearer picture of what you’re capable of keeps the panic at bay, and you’re left bouncing between elation at the prospect of getting your life back and the terror of launching a professional career and assuming the adult responsibilities that come with it.

Law school is temporary. It doesn’t last forever. This is both good and bad. Good, because law school is tough and exhausting. Bad, because as the memories of pure panic fade and those moments you shared with your peers come front and center, the last thing you want to do is give them up. It may be fair to analogize law school to childbirth: The mind blacks out all the painful parts so that when it is all over the whole experience feels more meaningful than exhausting.


From left: Bri Hanschu, Alison McCourt, Jennifer Hackman, Lauren Bavitz, Ashlyn Lindskog, Suzanne Hale   Andrea Horvath.

I don’t know the science of it all, but what I do know is that I don’t remember the mechanics of surviving as clearly as I remember studying for 1L finals with a group of my friends and laughing hysterically at how unprepared we all felt. I remember having whiteboard races to see who could get the information out the fastest and yelling at each other while we competed. I remember taking over a classroom during 2L finals and bringing snacks and a space heater and trying to teach each other legal concepts. I remember hosting baby showers and engagement parties and finding any excuse to celebrate. I remember golfing with my professor and dancing at the various law school events. And I remember how reassuring it felt to be surrounded by people who not only understood my daily struggle, but truly wanted to see me succeed. The kind of people who share in your little victories as if they were their own and refuse to allow you drop of out law school because you don’t have any clean clothes.

The best advice I can offer is to be aware from the beginning how special the relationships you form in Green Hall are. Take the time to build relationships and nurture them throughout your time as a law student. If you do that, many of your peers will turn into friends and confidants and the kind of people you’d wake up for at 4:00 in the morning to analyze a conversation from the night before. KU Law offers you this incredible opportunity to not only create professional relationships that will last throughout your career, but to leave with lifelong friends who will support you even after you’re all gone. The type of friends who will confidently refer clients to you in one breath and question your competency as an adult in another.

Those are the moments you want to take with you when you leave Green Hall, and it is my sincere hope that when you’re a 3L giving yourself a pep talk to get through the last 83 days, you are reminded of how lucky and grateful you are for the opportunity to share this experience with some of the most brilliant, loyal, supportive, encouraging and inspiring peers. It will all get done and you will eventually be an attorney, but for what my opinion is worth, it’s better to be an attorney with really awesome friends and really awesome stories.

Ashlyn Lindskog is a third-year law student and KU Law student ambassador from El Dorado, Kansas.

Judicial Clinic ‘puts things in perspective’ for 2L

Tue, 2015-02-24 11:12
Second-year law student Maureen Orth aspires to be a litigator, and just halfway through law school, she’s well on her way.
“While you learn a lot in your first year, there’s a lot that you don’t understand until you’ve actually seen it,” Orth said. “Getting to be in the courtroom and getting to see different proceedings has really helped flesh out my academic coursework and understand how it all fits together.”
Through KU Law’s Judicial Clinic, Orth works with Chief Magistrate Judge James P. O’Hara of the U.S. District Court for the District of Kansas, a 14-year veteran of the bench with private practice experience. Her duties include observing proceedings, writing orders, reading motions and getting feedback from the judge and his clerks.
“You have unique access to judges at the state and federal level, and equally exciting, you have access to his or her clerks,” Orth said. “I’m getting feedback on my writing from those same people who are researching and writing for the judge. That is an invaluable experience to get in law school.”
The clinic serves as a sort of living laboratory, with Orth learning case law in class one day, then witnessing how those legal concepts play out in the courtroom the next. She recalls taking Criminal Procedure as she was observing criminal proceedings in the courtroom, seeing how search warrants were used and how special agents and U.S. attorneys presented testimony. This semester Orth is taking Evidence and witnessing firsthand how parties enter evidence at motion hearings.
“I can see the benefits of being prepared versus using boilerplate objections,” Orth said. “I can see how what I’m learning will be applicable in the future.”
Beyond the technical aspects, Orth has been welcomed into the Kansas City legal community, learning each judge’s stylistic conventions and building a valuable professional network.
“As someone who does not have anyone in their family who practices law, a lot of the proceedings were unfamiliar,” Orth said. “I’m hoping to practice in the Kansas City area, so familiarity with how the courthouse works is helpful.”
Her courthouse colleagues have offered Orth everything from research and writing tips, to input on career opportunities and advice on which classes to take. The Judicial Clinic also offers a welcome departure from time the classroom, providing a glimpse of life after law school. “Sometimes in law school it can feel like you’re on pause because a lot of people our age are working already,” Orth said. “To get up and go to work feels all the more closer to being a working professional. You’re working on court orders and doing research that affects someone’s actual case, as opposed to the hypotheticals in class. It puts things in perspective.”

Ultimately, the clinic offers students the hands-on experience employers are seeking in addition to an understanding of theory and case law. “There are few things more valuable that KU offers than the clinic experience,” Orth said. “Law is so interesting from a theoretical standpoint, but until you actually see how it plays out in court, you don’t understand how it all comes together.”

- Maureen Orth is a second-year law student from Prairie Village, Kan.

Some secrets to law school success

Thu, 2015-02-19 13:32

Networking, anxiety and keeping things in perspective

It's February of my 3L year, and I am flying high. Instead of reading for my one real class, I go to trivia night with my roommates. Instead of writing yet another draft of my Law Review note, I watch “The Bachelor” (#TeamWhitney). Instead of stressing out over Lawyering assignments, I plan weekend trips to visit the friends I can finally make a priority in my life again.

Man, I hate myself just reading that. I'm sorry.

Here's the thing: Like anything else you’ve jumped into blindly, it gets better with time. Two years ago, I could not see the light at the end of the tunnel. Even last year, I felt like I was sinking in a never-ending pit of stress, anxiety and competition. But I slogged through, and it got so much better. To some extent, this is just a natural product of time and experience. Shoot a thousand free throws and you get better at shooting free throws. Do a bunch of musicals and you get better at doing musicals. Take a dozen law school exams and, hey, guess what?! You get better at law school exams. (I am fairly certain this logic is true – I haven't played sports in a decade, and the musical thing is but a lifelong dream).

That said, in the nostalgic and sentimental cruise down memory lane that inevitably accompanies every senior year I’ve ever done, I have been reflecting on the whole law school extravaganza and there are some things I wish I had known earlier. Here are a few of them, compiled from both my own thoughts and with some input from my fellow upperclass comrades who have also conquered this monster of a ride:

You have to network

I can’t count the number of times someone said, "You've got to network!” and the number of times I said “.... but I don’t want to.” I hate networking. It makes me uncomfortable and weird, and all I want is to run away from meaningless small talk about the cold winter we’ve been having and how much work law school is. But, alas, it is so. so. important. It’s the only way to get a job – all the As in the world won’t cover up your extreme awkwardness when you are forced to chat with a dozen people in the span of a callback interview. But it doesn’t end there. Law school events, from summer internship parties to visiting speakers to random conversations with professors in the hallway pretty much begin and end with small talk. Most of us are interchangeable based on our resumes – good grades, involvement in frivolous college organizations that we bill as “leadership,” a study abroad experience that was really a nonstop party, a couple of unpaid internships – so you have to be a functioning human in person. With opinions. But not too many opinions. NEVER HAVE TOO MANY OPINIONS because you will anger someone, and that someone will be a law firm partner, and then you’re done. So I would tell 1Ls to network, but network wisely. Network with care.

All you have is your reputation

Perhaps a piggyback on the last point. [Side note: How many times have you heard, “I’m just going to piggyback off that idea...” in law school classes? More than a thousand? Definitely.] Anyway, I’m going to piggyback real quickly. I think all legal communities are relatively small, but that is definitely true in Kansas and the Kansas City area. It can be a great thing: one small connection, and you're basically walking into a web of opportunities. But it can also be a not-so-great thing: one small connection, and you’re basically walking into a web of disaster. The legal community is small and news (and gossip) travels quickly. Watch what you do and watch what you say because it does follow you for the length of your career. Be nice to each other, and make friends wherever you can. You will need these connections because you will truly be around the same people for the rest of your life.

Anxiety is OK

I have always been fairly anxious, but I managed it fine until law school. This environment was completely new and demanding in a way I wasn’t ready for, and I went a wee crazy for a little bit. I wish someone had told me it was going to happen, or at least when it happened that I would be OK. I will forever be grateful for my best friend, Celina, who was one of my roommates at the time of my anxiety-induced brain fog situation (Google it: It’s real and it’s scary). One desperate night I tried to explain to her what was happening, and she told me in her best nursing student/calm friend voice, “It’s just stress. You will be OK." And even though I probably freaked her out, that is what I needed to hear in that moment. Because it was just stress. And I was OK. But to have a semester’s worth of anxiety, fear, stress and self-doubt come crashing down on you in a flaming explosion where it seems like you are literally going insane was really not what I was anticipating when I started law school. So I would tell incoming law students or 1Ls or maybe even 2Ls who are facing a new batch of stressors: It’s just stress. You will be OK. And also: Go to the doctor, man! No one wants to talk about mental health because we are Strong People Who Don’t Need Help, but sometimes we need help. And that’s OK.

Ask for help to figure out the rules of the game ASAP

None of us know how to do law school. Starting day one, we have to read 20-30 pages a night for each class and are expected to be able to talk about every fact, every rule, every issue, every policy rationale, every dissent, and how everything fits together. OK ... go! And then we are expected to condense it into a brief synopsis that you could memorize and apply to any set of facts. And then we are expected to eloquently articulate it on a three-hour exam and do it better than everyone else in the class can do it. I wish I had reached out to someone and asked him or her to go through a week’s worth of law school with me. Just sit next to me and guide me through it, like an older sibling teaching her little sister how to tie her shoes. I wish someone had explained how to be prepared for class without overstressing the night before. I wish someone had made me figure out time management. I wish someone had explained to me how to outline. I wish someone had shown me how to write a law school exam, one that just gives the professor what he or she wants instead of being a jumbled mess of rules and cases. I mean, I get that we all have to figure that out on our own, it’s all part of the “process” or whatever, but as long as we’re talking about things I wish I had known, I’ll add this to the list.

Nothing is a disaster

So simple to say, so hard to remember. These are not my words (thanks, Emily!) but they sum up the message perfectly. We are in law school, which is such a privilege. We get to spend our days talking about abstract theoretical concepts and hypotheticals. We are so lucky to have the chance to get graduate degrees in a country and a world where that’s not a reality for everyone. My worst days in law school are heavenly compared to so many people’s lives. The things that stress me out are inconveniences – a lot of reading, a lot of pressure, a lot of information crammed into my head – but they are not problems. I wish someone had made me remember that. I wouldn’t have listened, clearly, because I get too wrapped up in my head and lose perspective. But I wish I had done a better job of remembering that it would be fine, that I would pass my classes and graduate and be a lawyer and it would not matter how my final trial in Trial Ad went or if my Law Review paper was not superb. The little failures or the bad days just do not matter in the long run. It will be fine. Nothing is a disaster.

Keep on marching. Savor the good experiences, and do your best to move past the bad. Three years honestly flies by; one day you’re nervously sitting alone in the hallway in your OCI suit, wondering how you can be so sweaty in January, and the next thing you know, you’re booking hotels in the middle of Missouri for the bar exam and hoping your friends like you enough to be character references for your application. 3L year does arrive. And once it does, it’s glorious.

Jordan Carter is a third-year law student and a KU Law Student Ambassador from Topeka, Kansas.

Why KU
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